We're flying to France, non-stop from Philadelphia to Paris next Wednesday. We plan on bringing our rather large car seat (Britax Marathon) on the flight for our 2.5 yr old who is on the petite side. Our friend is a Car Seat Technician and has given us a lot of safety information including the importance of keeping children rear facing (in cars/airplanes/trains) for as long as they can. This is the safest position for all people, child or adult.
I am a bit concerned that the passenger in front of us will not be happy that he/she will not be able to put their seat back on such a long flight and will throw a fit. I know I'd be unhappy if I were in that person's shoes but I do not intend to compromise my child's safety for any reason.
Anyone ever have to deal with this on either side of the coin?
Interesting question. Have you checked with your airline regarding their policy? Even if you have facts on your side, the airline may prohibit you from impeding the seat in front of you.
ellen
Posts: 2898 | Location: mahwah, new jersey, usa | Registered: 10 December 2003
A similiar situation happened on my flight from Boston to Zurich. A family had a car seat for a 1 year old that impeded the passenger in front of them from putting their seat back. It was not rear facing and not as big as yours. This passenger was not happy about the situation, so the stewardess asked 3 people in the bulk head seats (who were sitting next to me) if they would change places with this family and happily for everyone they did. This negated the problem. I have to say that the child did very well in the front facing position and spent some of the time moving around in the bulk head area to keep him happy. As a pediatric nurse practitioner and a parent, I am sensitive to your safety concerns and I'm sure you got good advice, but I would feel perfectly confident having a child in a regular car seat in a flight situation. But then again I think flying is safer than driving and of course you need to do what you feel most comfortable with. I would imagine that the person in front of you would not be happy about not being able to put their seat back on a long flight. Hopefully, you will be as lucky as the parents on my flight. Good Luck!
I second the recommendation to check ahead of time with your airline carrier. I was on a recent flight where a flight attendant insisted a parent re-install a carseat to be front facing, indicating it was in violation of airline rules to have it fact the rear. The parent in question was NOT happy, but as the only viable alternative seemed to be to remove the car seat completely, complied.
Posts: 1638 | Location: Berkeley, CA | Registered: 22 March 2005
MamaZ--do whatever you can to get a bulkhead seat. As you say, the person sitting in front of the carseat will be very unhappy and deserves to have a reclining seat on such a long haul. It just isn't fair to that person. So--try, try to get the bulkhead.
I posed your questions/comments to my friend the car seat tech and here's what she wrote:
quote:
I do NOT agree w/ checking w/ the airlines ahead of time. The customer service reps that answer the phones are totally not familiar w/ the use of car seats on airplanes and most airlines don't have any written guidelines. I've actually called and requested them from both USAirways and AirTran twice and have gotten nowhere. Without written guidelines the CS rep can tell you anything they want and then when you get on the plane the FA still will tell you what they want to...since you have no proof of what the CS rep said.
So your best bet is to go w/ the written info from "official" sources such as the FAA and the car seat manufacturer.
Additionally, you can always pose it to the person in front of you that it will be better for them to have the car seat rearfacing behind them because then Isadora can't kick their seat for the entire flight
If the FA absolutely refuses after being presented w/ the info, then you can ask to be switched to the bulkhead (you will have to stash all your carry ons up top though) or turn the seat forward facing. YES, it is much safER to be rear facing on the plane, and if I was in that position I would be pissed as hell, but it isn't the end of the world if she's forward facing. Heck you are way ahead of the majority of parents flying w/ their kids just by using any seat at all!
Get your info together, bring it with you and be kind but firm...if it doesn't work out forward face Isadora and then write an irate letter to the airlines. Change doesn't come unless to them unless forced into it by the consumer.
And this about it being just as safe to be forward facing on an airplane:
quote:
Air travel is proven to be much safer than car travel; however, rear-facing on aircraft is even more important than in cars, as the spacing between airplane seats is so limited that a child in a forward-facing seat will very likely impact the seat in front of them...even in a minor crash or during turbulence.
And this from the Director of an organization called SafetyBeltSafe USA:
quote:
"The reason for putting the children rear-facing is that there is so little space between plane seats that there isn't room for the typical head excursion. Granted, the most common problem is clear air turbulence; however, when CAMI (Civil Aeromedical Institute) did the testing on safety seats on airplane seats, that was their recommendation. The reason one uses the forward-facing seats at all is that in turbulence, the child does better with harness straps. But there isn't a much likelihood that the seat wouldn't strike the seat in front."
So, I'm hoping the FAs don't put up a fight but if they do I'll have my documents in hand. If that fails I'll ask for bulkhead seats. And if that's still a no go I hope I can keep my cool
Posts: 58 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: 10 April 2006
I still don't think it can hurt to be pre-emptive and call the airline, explain your situation and ask for the bulkhead seats now. B/c push comes to shove, if you don't do as the flight attendants instruct you to do, documents or not, they can and will remove you from the plane, not to mention the delays it will cause at boarding time.
Can you request a bulk head before even getting to the airport
It can't hurt to try. I've been told they save them for people with babies and other necessities. When my mom broke her foot and needed the extra space, but couldn't sit in an exit row (b/c of the broken foot), they put her in a bulkhead ahead of time.
I would call, explaining your travelling with your young child, in a rear facing car-seat, and you don't want to impede the movement of the person sitting in front of you, is it possible to get a bulkhead.
Mama Z, I completely understand your concern regarding the safety of your child, however given the level of your concern it might have been wise to check airline policies before booking your flights. The alternative would have been to book business class seats where there is ample space between rows.
I agree with Kim, ask for the bulkhead seats now, and failing that make sure you get to the airport VERY early so that you are first on the list for bulkhead seats to be issued at check in. It is my understanding that these seats are normally reserved for families with small children.
As the passenger in front of you I know I would be somewhat annoyed at being told that I could not recline my seat..... but I would be FURIOUS if you suggested to me that
quote:
it will be better for them to have the car seat rearfacing behind them because then Isadora can't kick their seat for the entire flight
Long flights with small children can sometimes be difficult for the child, the parents and other passengers, requiring everyone to exhibit a little patience and understanding. I trust you will not allow Isadora to kick the seat of the unfortunate passenger in front of her.
Sheena
Posts: 2180 | Location: West Vancouver, B.C. Canada | Registered: 28 February 2004
According to the FAA web site, only children under 20 lbs. should be in rear facing seats, and only in those that are FAA approved.
Getting in an argument with the flight attendants rarely has a positive outcome (think air marshals, being escorted off the flight, ruining your vacation, etc.). Is making your point worth the risk? All due respect to your friend, but it's not her vacation at risk. Call ahead and try to resolve this before you leave for the airport.
ellen
Posts: 2898 | Location: mahwah, new jersey, usa | Registered: 10 December 2003
Yes you can arrange bulkhead seats ahead of time. That should have been done when you booked your flight. By all means try now; however, it is quite likely that another family has now reserved them. These are the perfect seats for your needs. Also, I have found that calling ahead to airlines to review a situation is a profitable way to do things rather than wait until the last minute when employees are very busy with other concerns. I disagree with your friend as to the competence in the people who handle pre-flight questions and concerns. As very frequent fliers (1,000,000+ miles), we have had much experience in this area and with flying with a child. Making a scene on board the plane that threatens to delay an international flight could possibly end by being escorted off the plane. Try to get this settle prior to flight day would be my advice.
Try to do everything you can before getting on the flight. If you arrive at the flight ready for a fight that is what you are going to get. Remember you get a lot more with sugar than salt.
Here's another thought if all else fails. See if Papa Z can get the seat in front of your child. It might not be what you consider as an ideal traveling situation, but it would certainly eliminate the possibility of various forms of confrontation that might happen.
Here is another thought.. if your car seat is too big it will not fit properly on the plane's seat and will have to be checked! This happened to us a couple of years ago. Luckily our daughter was almost three so it was not a big deal but I would be sure to check with the airlines to see if the dimensions of your car seat will fit properly.
According to the FAA web site, only children under 20 lbs. should be in rear facing seats, and only in those that are FAA approved.
The car seat is FAA approved so therefore it complies with all of the size restrictions for an airplane seat. As for the weight restrictions for rear facing, the information on the FAA site you linked to says:
quote:
Always follow the manufacturer's instructions when using a CRS. The FAA recommends that a child weighing:
Less than 20 pounds use a rear-facing CRS From 20 to 40 pounds use a forward-facing CRS More than 40 pounds use an airplane seat belt
According to the manufacturer's instructions, it is safest for a child to be rf and they can do so until they reach within an inch of the top of the seat or 30#. This is why I intend to bring the manufacturer's instructions with that information highlighted.
We're going to call ahead to see if we can get the bulkhead seats. If not, I like Suzanne's suggestion of having PapaZ in front of the babe.
I intend to come off as a concerned/informed parent but will not get into a fight over this if it comes to it. As much as I want her rear facing I won't jeopardize our flight over it! I might be bull-headed but I'm not a moron France, here we come!
Posts: 58 | Location: Pennsylvania | Registered: 10 April 2006
Have you considered purchasing a smaller car seat for this trip? My daughter uses a Brimax also, but has a smaller seat that she uses for flights and in my car. Some airlines will not allow the Brimax to be used, it is big, and although it meet FAA regs, if the flight attendant/pilot say no, it goes. They have the final word on any equipment used on the plane. The smaller seat has made life much easier (my granddaughter is a frequent flyer!) while maintaining safety.
I hope you have a great trip!
Posts: 605 | Location: Rehoboth, MA USA | Registered: 30 August 2003
Topic Closed
France, here we come!
