I just put up an article on my blog about my own experiences with the differences between American and European culture, but I wanted to post here on the board and see what other people's responses were.

When I say cultural differences, I'm not just talking about what people say or what they talk about. I mean things like how bathrooms in Europe are generally a lot smaller (having been added later), and how people have different ideas about "time sense." For example, in the US I want to be in and out of a restaurant in 45 minutes; in Italy, meals can take something like 2 hours.

So, for all of you Slow Travelers... when you go over to Europe, what are the biggest differences that you notice, and how do you react to and deal with them?

Hopefully I'm starting an interesting topic here.

Several years ago, one of my cousins in Italy told me that he had once turned down a very good job offer because it would have involved working at a location so far from home that it would not have permitted him to return home for lunch.

In my experience, here in the US, most people leave their homes early in the morning, commute to work, and don't return home until dinnertime. Often, our rush-hour commutes involve one or even two hours travel time and returning home for lunch isn't even a consideration.

In Italy (or maybe even elsewhere in Europe), folks work later in the evening but the lunch break is at least two hours and returning home is very important.

Or, at least, it was. I understand that this is now changing and working hours are becoming more like they are here in the US.

Anyhow, this was one cultural difference that made a big impression on me back when I first started visiting family in Italy.

I was surprised to see that "smaller" is better. Smaller houses, smaller refrigerators, smaller cars, smaller food portions.

Do we really need to be supersized?

quote:

Do we really need to be supersized?

Another cousin, who visited me here in NY, said he was amazed at seeing people walking around the City with BIG cups of drinks as well as the BIG sizes of portions served in restaurants.

No closets. Or if they are closets they are basically modified cabinets.

Which also says something about european culture. They buy fewer, better clothes instead of 40 different outfits they have 4.

Also when you buy a place even if it IS screwed down or attached it gets taken with the previous owner. I walked into Fabio and Nicolletta's new apartment and they had taken the light bulbs!!!

quote:

Also when you buy a place even if it IS screwed down or attached it gets taken with the previous owner.

This is true. I was surprised that you take your kitchen with you when you move.

If I may include Norway...

Almost everything. It's so strange up there, from my perspective anyway. I can't put it into words but here is one example:

Goverment has a complete and absolute monopoly over wine and liquor. You can only go to the city-operated store (there is only one or two in the entire city) to buy a bottle of wine yet people are shooting up drugs in public parks are left alone.

Hmmm, well, I wondered why the showers only have 1/2 door?

That was the biggest first-time thing I noticed.

Jennifer

I was surprised by the French solution to bathing and toileting - a separate room for each. And not so pleasantly surprised at how cold houses are in the winter - on purpose.

Callie

I'm thinking back to my first trip to Europe in the seventies, and Italy made quite an impression on me- especially Rome probably because I spent the most time there. The european clothes were cut and fit differently,and many men carried purses, usually on a wrist strap. You don't see that any more, in fact the general dress in Rome is much more like North Americans now. I'm not sure now whether the purses were a cultural thing or just a passing style of the time. All I know is that you didn't see it in Vancouver!

Some things that I learned then are still the custom, like not touching the fruit at the market. I picked up a peach from a stall in Venice and almost got my hand slapped. I can still picture the look of scorn 30 years later! Another nice custom is greeting the proprietor as you enter a store and saying goodbye when you leave. This seems much more civilized than the way it is done here.

Wow, I'm glad I posted this topic! These are some really fun replies that I hadn't even thought of. I always like to try and think of the reasons for why these different customs exist.

The only one I have a real explanation for is the "closets," or more accurately wardrobes. I think most places were built very simply originally, without the complex little alcoves that we put in our houses today. Basically just straight, square walls. Plus many bedrooms today used to serve as something else, so they would not have a closet anyway. And the only real way to add a closet to a room is to put in a wardrobe.

I didn't know about the "taking the kitchen" with you! It sounds really funny, but in general I think people (I'm thinking of Italians here) are just very conservative and don't like to waste anything. Over here in the US we have this "if it's broke, toss it and get another one" mentality, but over there everything gets saved and repaired. Maybe taking the kitchen with you is just a part of that feeling.

Also, I would LOVE to live in a place where going home for lunch was normal!!!!

Regarding the "man-purse:" this is a fashion statement that has since moved on to China. No kidding.

As you can tell, I was surprised by the "bathroom stuff"...so you can imagine my expression when we were at Les Baux and I was pointed to a room with a hole in the floor for the ladies restroom...complete with an attendant with a garden hose in her hand...was that for the floor or ??? I'm chuckling...

Jennifer

BTW, I walked out...

quote:

In Italy (or maybe even elsewhere in Europe), folks work later in the evening but the lunch break is at least two hours and returning home is very important.

I got clued into this reading Donna Leon's mysteries placed in Venice (which I love, by the way). Her protagonist, police inspector Brunetti, goes home every day for a couple of hours. When I read this in the first of the series, I was thinking, "Gee, hard job but somebody's gotta do it". I misinterpreted it as a sign of low level corruption or privilege. Only later did I get that at least in theory, they work later.

Karen

I just want to go off-topic here and say how much I appreciate how kind and considerate everyone is on the Slowtalk forums. I've posted on other forums before and half the time you have to worry about phrasing everything exactly so that people don't jump all over you for saying the wrong thing! I posted virtually this same topic on another (unnamed) forum and the responses I got were mostly criticisms about how I had asked the question!

On Slowtalk, people seem to give everyone else the benefit of the doubt by assuming that we're not trying to offend anyone! Anyway, I think I'll be posting mainly here from now on...

It is an interesting topic, but since I am European (although many of my countrymen would be horrified at this thought) I cannot really comment.

On the point about discussions on Slowtalk - I think maybe it is an attitude. I know I am generalising, but those who don't consider a vacation worth taking unless they can cram 3 cities into a day, maybe more inclined to shoot down posters. On another forum to which I post - Which shall remain nameless, but think guidebook, This topic would very quickly degenerate into a cross Atlantic feud with a great deal of Flag waving and "My country right or wrong".

Tim

quote:

so you can imagine my expression when we were at Les Baux and I was pointed to a room with a hole in the floor for the ladies restroom...complete with an attendant with a garden hose in her hand...was that for the floor or ???

Oh my gosh, I just busted out laughing in the middle of my office! What a mental image...

I loved how everybody did LITERALLY take time to stop and smell the flowers. Every park we went to had tons of people chilling back and enjoying the parks. Me and my friend stopped in Tuillieres Gardens(sp)every evening before going to dinner so that we could sit and watch the children play in the pond. There is a gentleman that rents these little boats with poles. The children run along and push the boats (or attempt to) around the water. Also, we saw a lot of men with their children. Much more than I typically see here in the States. Just my observation. I loved the enjoyment of being outside and really appreciating it.

Trash handling was the one that got me. I was alone in Rome for a month and it took me a week to figure out what to do with the trash. I looked all over the building for a receptacle, with no luck. Now, I'd been walking by the containers in the street all week but never noticed them until one day when the guy in front of me stopped to toss in his garbage. Problem solved!

"Rules". Or at least cultural do's and don'ts. These "rules" are most certainly variable depending on where you are.
A very good example of this can be found in the "sauce sopping thread." To sop or not to sop, bread with pasta (or not), etc. etc.

Other examples of rules I've encountered:
Don't use strong flavored cheeses in a seafood dish
Do say "buon appetito" before digging in
Do say "Permesso" before entering a home
Do say "cin cin" or "salute" or some other toast before drinking
Drinks:
Don't drink cappuccino in the evening
An aperitivo is ordered before a meal (not after)
A digestivo is ordered after a meal (not before)
Here in the US, my experience is that folks will drink whatever they feel like drinking without regard to the time of day...
I met some relatives in Italy in a neighborhood bar before going on to dinner. We all ordered drinks. I was about to order a glass of Teroldego (a local red wine) and my cousin suggested that something else might be a better aperitivo or "before dinner" drink.
Another time, my husband and I took my two elderly uncles (one of whom was a retired priest) on an outing to Santuario S. Romedio. We stopped in the bar at the Santuario and offered them refreshments (expecting them to order un caffe or una spremuta) - they both ordered a glass of wine - "white". "Of course white" said the young woman tending bar "it's morning." (It was about 10 am!)
My kind of country!

What I found strange was in Lucca people put their garbage out on their door step in small plastic bags. There was no trash can and it looked like no one had much garbage but, nonetheless, it was not a pleasant sight.

I think the biggest thing for me was not only the formality with which food is ordered and eaten (don't scowl at me for ordering a latte after 3pm. If it bothers you that much don't offer them. I need a pick-me-up), but the fact that you can ONLY eat at dinner time, or lunch time, etc.
My first month in Florence I was starving every night by dinner time. Eventually I got used to it, but it was tough. Thank goodness for Pizza Taxi - they deliver whenever.

I was also a little surprised with how dirty the streets are. Yikes! Totally didn't expect that and ruined two pair of khakis upon arrival. It was a good thing tho, I look better in black anyway.

quote:

I need a pick-me-up), but the fact that you can ONLY eat at dinner time, or lunch time, etc.
My first month in Florence I was starving every night by dinner time.

It not so much that one is expected to eat only at meals. My first generation italian mother instilled this discipline into us. The problem with Italian meals for us North Americans is the timing. other than eating a huge breakfast, at home, I am not sure how one is expected to last until italian lunch at 1PM? There are no Italian breakfast places unless you want to count the bakeries and eat pastries in the morning. My daughter and I started going to bakeries for snacks and eating only one real meal a day at either Italian lunch or dinner. I am not sure how families with children have any time togehter after the late Italian dinner. how do children last until italian dinner at 7 PM? Who fixes Italian dinnner if the woman works late like I hear Italians do to compensate for the 2 hour hiatus in the middle of the day? I wonder about a lot of this stuff. I find it hard to put together into a cohesive picture of what their life is like.

Loved the wonderful food of France, and that the shops closed in the afternoon for a little while. REAL BUTTER croissants!! Yum! Not like the yucky Crisco ones in the US. (Ugh!)

I was surprised the toilet paper in public bathrooms was so bad, but I guess we're spoiled in the US. Cereal isles in the grocery stores were non existant when I was there. Only a samll part of one side of an aisle had cereals. The French must think we Americans are just nutty for cold cereal when they see our cereal aisles! Not that I missed the gazillions of choices, but the lack of them was very noticable.

Loved all the dogs in the passenger seat in the taxis.

Small rural restaurants put wine bottles on the rows of tables pushed together. I thought it was fun to eat with strangers at those tables, and we all drank from the same bottle of wine! Also, I ordered chocolate mousse and was brought a huge bowl of it to dish out how much I wanted! Love it!

I also suspect the French think we're nuts to vacation on a bateau (canal boat) and do all the locks, but we think that kind of work on a vacation is pretty cool. We just like anything new and different I guess.

Here in the US, we make fun of ourselves, our family, our politicians, our president. Everybody is fair game. I didn't hear much of that in France. Also, I think we have way less "class" differentiation.

Some of the above may have changed over the years. Or I may have gotten the wrong impression. I will take no offense if I am corrected on any of my observations of differences in culture.

I absolutely love France and mean no disrespect. I can hardly wait to take my husband there someday and stay on Rue Cler in Paris, visit Peche Merl cave, the chateaus of the Loire Valley, medievel villages, and fresh oysters!! (Just to name a few of the things I want to share with him.)

We noticed the bedding as being different.
We are used to a sheet and blanket on a nice mattress.
In Austria, Germany and Czech Republik we got the typical down comforter that served as a top sheet and blanket.

Also the breakfast was different. Cheese and smoked (not the crispy) bacon. Warm "dinner" rolls and assorted cold meats.

Dogs (well behaved) allowed in restaurants.
Water dishes set out for passing dogs.

People eating at "community" tables.

Taking off your blouse and just wearing your bra while relaxing a bit at the beach.

Children eating with their families at 10:00 at night. Children drinking wine with their meals.

Leaving your room key (your great BIG key..) at the front desk when you leave for the day.

NO SCREENS on your windows!

Older women more modest dressing in Europe. Also noted more people dressed conservative in churches. Kids weren't wearing baggy jeans with their under-duds peeking out in the churches.

I liked the greetings when coming and going in the shops. Also the Guten Morgen greetings when we came down to breakfast.